Laura Mercier Caviar Sticks! ...shocked! read this!

Oct 18, 2011

Jessica S.

I just became a little more educated by putting this into google to have a better understanding lol The site I came across said:

"Ferric Ferrocyanide and Ferric Ammonium Ferrocyanide are safe for use in coloring externally applied cosmetics and personal care products, including products applied to the area of the eye, when these ingredients conform to FDA specifications"

and

"These ingredients are not allowed to be used in products intended for use on the lips"

Hmmm. Hard question about the waterline. The sales lady could be wrong. It may really irritate your eyes :| be careful x x

Oct 18, 2011

DJ M.

You'd be surprised, ferric ammonium ferrocyanide is fairly common in blue cosmetics! I'm pretty health-conscious, but I love my colors as well. When in doubt, I try to stay away from it. At the same time, many things are not lip approved that are eye approved for similar reasons to this ingredient. You're completely right to question the waterline. Because cosmetic companies in the US aren't regulated by the FDA unless they do so voluntarily, I feel as though there's just less overall care here about the little details (like this) that we makeup lovers would think about. Are other countries similar? I know that the EU is more strict than we are. Ok, it's eye approved because it's ok for external use, but if you like to tight-line your eyes ... what then?

If you want to read more about this specific ingredient this site is fabulous! They often cover international regulations: http://www.ewg.org/skindeep/ingredient/702453/FERRIC_AMMONIUM_FERROCYANIDE/

Personal choice I guess at the end of the day. I know plenty of makeup lovers that wouldn't think twice, but I research and write about ingredients in my blog when I have the time to do in-depth research. I've never done a post on this.

Oct 18, 2011

DJ M.

It looks like the major concern is neurotoxicity, so the long-term affects of using a certain amount on the nervous system is the bottom line. Once you get into so many ingredients it's like ... WHAT??? haha

Oct 18, 2011

DJ M.

So many of them are haha. I don't regularly use products with silicone, parabens, pthalates, GMO soy, etc. So much work to find the good stuff!!!

Oct 18, 2011

Shelly T.

The EWG website is NOT a reliable source. In fact, they have NO science to back up their claims. They're just a bunch of scaremongering professional bs-ers.

On this post by Personal Care Truth, there is an MP3 from a session recorded in Colorado back in March 2010, when the Colorado Safe Personal Care Products Act was brought before the state's legislature. In the clip, Susan Roll -- a founding member of the Campaign for Safe Cosmetics (CFSC), a subset of the EWG -- straight up ADMITS CFSC doesn't have the science to back up their claims.

http://personalcaretruth.com/2010/06/straight-from-the-horses-mouth/ (you want the first MP3)

Plus, the EWG/CFSC are the main architects of the Safe Cosmetics Act of 2011 (HR 2359) -- a bill that would make it even MORE difficult to understand ingredient labels (not easier), that would (essentially) increase animal testing (something I believe most, if not all, of us would like to see eradicated), and would mean the end of any and all indie cosmetic companies. Personally, I believe what they really want is for all of us to stop wearing makeup altogether.

http://personalcaretruth.com/2011/07/ten-reasons-why-you-should-not-support-sca-2011/

The truth about ingredients?

Silicones? SAFE. Tarte's (a green brand!) ReCreate foundation contains silicones. Even Korres' (another green brand!) Wild Rose Foundation (the liquid one) contains silicones. Silicones are just slip agents that make your foundation easier to apply and even protect your skin. Silica -- which is basically what MUFE's HD and e.l.f.'s High Definition powder are -- is silicone in its pure, powder form.

Parabens? SAFE. (Some of them, I believe, are even naturally-derived.) They're just preservative agents, and they appear in concentrations of less than one percent. (They're safe to use in concentrations of all the way up to 25%.)
http://www.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/cos-para.html
http://cosmeticsinfo.org/HBI/9
http://personalcaretruth.com/2011/06/why-do-emulsions-need-preservatives/

Phthalates? So far, SAFE. (That said, certain ones have been banned in the EU.)
http://cosmeticsinfo.org/HBI/23
http://personalcaretruth.com/2010/05/phthalates-are-they-safe/

Ammonium ferrocyanide? SAFE. And by the way, colourants (which is what this is) DO need FDA approval to be used in cosmetics.

http://cosmeticsinfo.org/ingredient_more_details.php?ingredient_id=656

<<thats what i was saying! .... if you use this too much or it gets into your body ...Neurotoxicity! this product is basically a neurotoxin :P>>

Bollocks. Your own body contains and produces toxins every day, and it's more than capable of getting rid of them. Also, you're not ingesting this. You're simply putting a product on your eyes and removing it at the end of the day. A topical application. Your body will not absorb it.

Personally? I'll take the scientific evidence any day of the week over scaremongering. I refuse to live in fear, and I hope you will refuse to, too.

Oct 18, 2011

DJ M.

@Shelly I want to be clear and just say that I never said individual ingredients don't need FDA approval, I said cosmetic companies aren't regulated (100% true) unless they do so voluntarily. I don't want to start a debate and I completely agree that there are many that use scare tactics to coerce people to do one thing or the other, but as someone with cancer in my family I would rather listen to the numerous tests (including those done by the FDA) that suggest that certain ingredients are not healthy over time. For example, did you know that the ingredient used in many hand sanitizers and bacterial soaps was deemed by the FDA (not another agency, though I'm not a huge fan of the FDA in general) to be no more effective than regular soap and water? They also acknowledged that there were possible health concerns with this ingredient.

The FDA does not regulate cosmetic companies unless they volunteer themselves, they only approve or deny individual ingredients. I think it is 100% a personal choice and I have no issue whatsoever with others that don't mind using ingredients I try to avoid, but I'd be careful about inferring that the toxins produced by our bodies are comparable to those produced in a lab. There are plenty of scientific studies and evidence showing that different chemicals (including some used in cosmetics) have adverse affects. It takes a great deal of time for things that are already approved (things that were approved decades ago after testing was done that was primitive compared to what we are capable of now) to then undergo testing again and have their approval revoked. In an industry that isn't highly regulated, I personally prefer to do what makes me most comfortable. I would expect anyone else to do the same, chemicals or not :)

Keep in mind that one of the sites you reference in your profile has a disclaimer regarding using information on the site for cosmetic ingredient advice as well as limits as to the fact that information on the site is not guaranteed to be of a certain quality of level of completion: http://cosmeticsinfo.org/disclaimer.php

I think it's important to go to the actual source (the FDA website) if you want a super in-depth understanding. I reference specific FDA pages on my blog when I discuss ingredients because there's so much info to sift through. Either way, I appreciate your perspective and think you have every right to feel the way you do :) To each his/her own!

@Andrew Definitely do whatever makes you comfortable and fabulous! ;)